Harder moderation needed on the forums?

User avatar
LordBazooka
Hunter
Posts: 508
Joined: September 15th, 2012, 7:16 pm
Location: Cologne, Germany

Re: Harder moderation needed on the forums?

Postby LordBazooka » February 4th, 2014, 8:02 pm

BlindTyldak wrote:For example, the "only meaningful posts, please" rule. Yes, I know that to forum regulars posts like "+1" can get on nerves, but they are in response to the original post and while exceedingly short, not a "bad" thing. "I agree" may not be much better, but not everyone has much to say beyond that, but they want to contribute. I personally take that rule as more along the lines of "stick with the subject and don't post nonsense for the sake of posting nonsense". A thread titled "I like pie" with an original post of "discuss my like of pie plz" would be the sort of thing that was against the rule.


+1



And because i care for the feelings of others, i will explain why: Alot of players have the feeling, that if for example a suggestion reaches a large enough response in the forums, the devs will consider it. Don´t know if it´s true, but i guess so.
Also, what do you expect, if you visit a thread like "look at this pic, isn´t it a nice rifle you would like to have?" A bunch of repeating adjectives, how much people would like to have it? I rather go for 7 replies of +1, scroll past them and notice, that alot of people like it for the exact same reason as the op and then read the reply from the guy who doesn´t. Saves time. Also, who cares for post counts? Seriously.
User avatar
kring
Tracker
Posts: 112
Joined: October 17th, 2013, 4:59 am
Location: Limburgs, NL

Re: Harder moderation needed on the forums?

Postby kring » February 5th, 2014, 5:07 am

Thank you for your answers, especially the moderators! It's nice to see something like this being discussed.

BlindTyldak wrote:For example, the "only meaningful posts, please" rule. Yes, I know that to forum regulars posts like "+1" can get on nerves, but they are in response to the original post and while exceedingly short, not a "bad" thing. "I agree" may not be much better, but not everyone has much to say beyond that, but they want to contribute.

Flanker305 wrote:While I see your point, I have to say I do this too sometimes. Most of the times I did it was because the suggestion just sounded good to me and I was giving my vote to such a plan. Example here. (What do I have to say more? Just a good plan, bring it on.) It will be good to refrain from doing this too much, but my point is: let people give their vote the way they like it. If they wanna explain why, go ahead. The forum is to express opinions, and before we get threads filled with only +1's and +1000's I personally see no problem.

DriftPrize wrote:so you mean 2+2=4 and I have to discuss more about it than I agree or being sarcastic about it?

LordBazooka wrote:And because i care for the feelings of others, i will explain why: Alot of players have the feeling, that if for example a suggestion reaches a large enough response in the forums, the devs will consider it. Don´t know if it´s true, but i guess so.
Also, what do you expect, if you visit a thread like "look at this pic, isn´t it a nice rifle you would like to have?" A bunch of repeating adjectives, how much people would like to have it? I rather go for 7 replies of +1, scroll past them and notice, that alot of people like it for the exact same reason as the op and then read the reply from the guy who doesn´t. Saves time.

There's other ways than writing a superficial +1 to show your support for a suggestion or a post in general. This forum has a poll function people could use to give their +1's or -1's if they don't want to discuss why they think it's a good idea or not. I don't know if everyone can create a poll or if it's only the moderators (I sure can't find the button described in the FAQ so I guess the latter) but it would be a lot better way to show your support for an idea instead of drenching a topic in numerous posts. A poll would also be much easier for the developers to use as a basis if they implement the forum members ideas in their game, since you can with a glance see how many people have voted for a suggestion instead of make an estimate of how many +1 you see.

BlindTyldak wrote:One also has to be careful of discouraging new posters or less-than-regular forum members from discussing the game, particularly the topics that we see time and time again. There is only so many new things that can be said about a video game, particularly one that has a very static gameplay mechanism and endgame such as this (no matter what, you hunt and your "endgame" is killing something). Because of this, topic repeats are going to happen and happen often, especially in the eyes of those of us who are here daily or several times a week. Part of supporting a good game community is making sure that no one feels embarrassed for posting a legitimate question, even if that question was asked over and over again by other people. Ones that fall within a day or two can be merged, yes, but having only ONE thread for everything we see often would end up being pages of threads that people were expected to exclusively post on; confusing to new folks and a real headache for mods.

Although I can appreciate you wanting to make the members feel free in posting whatever question they have, even if it has been answered a hundred times over. But that also makes the search function quite obsolete... if people never even bother to search for the thing they want to ask then it's completely worthless in my opinion. I always make a habit out of searching for if anyone else had the same question I do and if they already got an answer for it.

I can also understand the headache about having a big thread for every topic but searching for an answer to a problem within a thread is a lot easier than trying to search for the correct thread out of dozens, in my opinion.

BlindTyldak wrote:Forum rules are not designed to be a burden on the community, they are there to provide a guide that can be enforced if there is an actual problem such as spam, bots, inflammatory behavior (or worse, which we have all seen), etc.

I don't think more strict forum rules would be a burden for the community, just the opposite. More strict and clear directives with what's allowed and tolerated would make the forum easier to navigate in my opinion, since there's less wiggle room for how to act.

Flanker305 wrote:When a thread is going in circles though, with several interventions by mods, and people keep getting off topic and such, why should we keep cleaning this thread up over and over again? In such cases I see no better solution than to lock it. I don't do it too often, and I am not triggerhappy to, so to say, but sometimes letting a thread be is just a waste of everybody's time.

Just extinguishing the flames of a fire won't prevent future fires, it's a lot better to take care of the problem at its roots. If people actually got suspended and in extreme cases banned for repeatedly going off-topic even after a moderator has given a warning, it might give them something to reflect about and prevent future problems. It's harsh but I think it might be effective.

Tod1d wrote:That's what the Report button is for. Please feel free to use it liberally.

Then I will!

DriftPrize wrote:This post is nothing but hate and discrimination.

Do you care to elaborate a bit with what you mean about hate and discrimination? It feels like this might go off-topic so you're welcome to write a PM!

Edit:
LordBazooka wrote:Also, who cares for post counts? Seriously.

In an ideal world, no one gives a damn. But I've seen numerous occasion when people actually use their own post count to validate that their opinion has a higher value than others with lower post count. It's very sad.
User avatar
LordBazooka
Hunter
Posts: 508
Joined: September 15th, 2012, 7:16 pm
Location: Cologne, Germany

Re: Harder moderation needed on the forums?

Postby LordBazooka » February 5th, 2014, 6:03 am

kring wrote:There's other ways than writing a superficial +1 to show your support for a suggestion or a post in general. This forum has a poll function people could use to give their +1's or -1's if they don't want to discuss why they think it's a good idea or not. I don't know if everyone can create a poll or if it's only the moderators (I sure can't find the button described in the FAQ so I guess the latter) but it would be a lot better way to show your support for an idea instead of drenching a topic in numerous posts. A poll would also be much easier for the developers to use as a basis if they implement the forum members ideas in their game, since you can with a glance see how many people have voted for a suggestion instead of make an estimate of how many +1 you see.


Then you have to create your topic in the poll section and not in the suggestion section. I still don´t get why you dislike those posts. IMHO it´s about saving time and effort for everyone and that´s a good thing. I´d rather skip a few +1 posts, than read walls of text, that basically say the exact same thing. And just because someone beat you to replying first, you can still voice your opinion and be part of the community by agreeing with a "+1" post. You shouldn´t take that from people, just because you dislike it for whatever personal reason.

In an ideal world, no one gives a damn. But I've seen numerous occasion when people actually use their own post count to validate that their opinion has a higher value than others with lower post count. It's very sad.


By saying this, you actually care about post counts and from what you said earlier, you want to reduce high post counts by choosing what is a good post and what is not. It´s the internet. If someone tells you, their argument is better, because they lurked the forums moar, you have already won the argument. If someone needs post counts to feel better, just let him and don´t let that affect you. Just remember, one day this forum will close as will all things on the internet. ;)
User avatar
kring
Tracker
Posts: 112
Joined: October 17th, 2013, 4:59 am
Location: Limburgs, NL

Re: Harder moderation needed on the forums?

Postby kring » February 5th, 2014, 6:39 am

LordBazooka wrote:Then you have to create your topic in the poll section and not in the suggestion section. I still don´t get why you dislike those posts. IMHO it´s about saving time and effort for everyone and that´s a good thing. I´d rather skip a few +1 posts, than read walls of text, that basically say the exact same thing. And just because someone beat you to replying first, you can still voice your opinion and be part of the community by agreeing with a "+1" post. You shouldn´t take that from people, just because you dislike it for whatever personal reason.

To me a forum is a place of discussion, and in my belief a +1 post doesn't add much discussion around the subject at hand. The CoC explicitly say "Attempts to artificially increase your post count are prohibited.", and in my world only a +1 is exactly that, an attempt to increase the post count just for the sake of it.
LordBazooka wrote:By saying this, you actually care about post counts and from what you said earlier, you want to reduce high post counts by choosing what is a good post and what is not. It´s the internet. If someone tells you, their argument is better, because they lurked the forums moar, you have already won the argument. If someone needs post counts to feel better, just let him and don´t let that affect you. Just remember, one day this forum will close as will all things on the internet. ;)

It's not as much as reducing high post counts than it is to actually encourage people use actual words to discuss different topics. Another forum I'm a member of has as its first rule "Quality before quantity", and I think this is an ideal goal to strive against.
User avatar
BigAl
Outfitter
Posts: 2906
Joined: February 22nd, 2009, 12:34 am
Location: South Texas, USA

Re: Harder moderation needed on the forums?

Postby BigAl » February 5th, 2014, 8:51 am

There are some good points you make but some of what you seem to think this forum needs in my opinion is not needed, and seem more like your own personal agenda on making this forum how you feel it should be and not what the majority would necessarily want.

If we had to live by all of your "rules" I don't think I would want to participate in this forum any longer, so personally, I'm glad you don't make the rules for this forum. I'm a member of many forums and the use of "+1" is common on all of them, just because you think something is good or bad doesn't mean we all have to abide by your personal likes and dislikes.

I can see your fairly new here kring by your join date and I hope you give this forum a chance because it really is a very good and well behaved community for the most part, and is one of the most civil game forums I've ever been on in my almost 20 years of PC gaming. I agree with the Mod's when they say to use the report button when you feel something is not right and let them decide what is or isn't acceptable, and then as long as the Mod's are ok with a post we will all accept how the Mod's let forum members make post and answer post. :)
BuckshotAl - Warden
User avatar
kring
Tracker
Posts: 112
Joined: October 17th, 2013, 4:59 am
Location: Limburgs, NL

Re: Harder moderation needed on the forums?

Postby kring » February 5th, 2014, 9:14 am

BigAl wrote:There are some good points you make but some of what you seem to think this forum needs in my opinion is not needed, and seem more like your own personal agenda on making this forum how you feel it should be and not what the majority would necessarily want.

If we had to live by all of your "rules" I don't think I would want to participate in this forum any longer, so personally, I'm glad you don't make the rules for this forum. I'm a member of many forums and the use of "+1" is common on all of them, just because you think something is good or bad doesn't mean we all have to abide by your personal likes and dislikes.

I can see your fairly new here kring by your join date and I hope you give this forum a chance because it really is a very good and well behaved community for the most part, and is one of the most civil game forums I've ever been on in my almost 20 years of PC gaming. I agree with the Mod's when they say to use the report button when you feel something is not right and let them decide what is or isn't acceptable, and then as long as the Mod's are ok with a post we will all accept how the Mod's let forum members make post and answer post. :)

Isn't a suggestion for how you want to change something, or as is more common on this forum, something you want added (to the game or community) always a personal agenda you want to convey to others? If so I can fail to see how I do anything wrong with suggesting the things I am with these posts.

And even if I'm fairly new on these forum should that mean I'm not allowed to give suggestions about how I think this forum can me made better? Making remarks like that is something I believe really discourages new posters for expressing their opinions. Whether I registered my account yesterday or when the forums first started should be of no consequence in the matter.
User avatar
BlindTyldak
Outfitter
Posts: 2213
Joined: August 11th, 2013, 1:58 am
Location: South Dakota

Re: Harder moderation needed on the forums?

Postby BlindTyldak » February 5th, 2014, 10:47 am

Kring has a good point, Al; someone may have joined the forums five minutes ago, but that does not mean that they have not been members of forums for various types of communities for longer than even some of our community members have been alive. Many folks have seen issues online in other places and voicing their concerns over what they may see take place here based upon personal experience certainly has merit regardless of the amount of time spent on this site specifically.

To address some of the other noted concerns, I think I have seen someone refer to their post count as a matter of authority maybe once or twice, but it was quickly shot down by other community members. Though it is something the mods monitor, it's really not as much of a problem here as other forums or sites that have forum tools that really "reward" people for post counts and make it appear that a high count is something of importance, like a rep function or anything of that sort. People use "+1" here for the most part really just to agree, but if the mods did see someone hitting every thread doing so in an automatic fashion or using other methods to artificially inflate their count, it would certainly be addressed.

The mods also take a lot more action against off-topic, flaming, and other negative activities than most people realize, I believe. One site I used to frequent had a "You've been a bad boy" thread where the mods would post their actions so that the public could see it; on one hand, it let people see that the mods had been active, but on the other hand it also started a lot of problems in its own right, so I don't think it would be a good idea for here. Anywhoo, just because people may not notice something different here doesn't mean something hasn't been done. :)

By all means, continue to discuss, though I am sure that everyone understands that while the mods are definitely watching, not all suggestions may be implemented.
User avatar
BigAl
Outfitter
Posts: 2906
Joined: February 22nd, 2009, 12:34 am
Location: South Texas, USA

Re: Harder moderation needed on the forums?

Postby BigAl » February 5th, 2014, 11:25 am

Kring I never said you were doing anything wrong with suggesting the things you did, or that you are not allowed to give suggestions about how you think this forum can be made better. I'm in no way trying to stop you from voicing your opinions of this community or making post on this forum. I simply disagreed with some of your assessments about this forum and it's community, and your interpretation of some of it's rules. I then stated my opinion on the subject to add to this discussion...I'm sorry if you misunderstood or took my opinion the wrong way. :)
BuckshotAl - Warden
User avatar
DriftPrize
Hunter
Posts: 643
Joined: January 18th, 2014, 2:09 pm
Location: SEA

Re: Harder moderation needed on the forums?

Postby DriftPrize » February 5th, 2014, 11:54 am

kring wrote:There's other ways than writing a superficial +1 to show your support for a suggestion or a post in general. This forum has a poll function people could use to give their +1's or -1's if they don't want to discuss why they think it's a good idea or not. I don't know if everyone can create a poll or if it's only the moderators (I sure can't find the button described in the FAQ so I guess the latter) but it would be a lot better way to show your support for an idea instead of drenching a topic in numerous posts.
A poll would also be much easier for the developers to use as a basis if they implement the forum members ideas in their game, since you can with a glance see how many people have voted for a suggestion instead of make an estimate of how many +1 you see.
Due to this answer you're reluctant to give an decisive answer to put blame on both participants the visionaries & moderator which most forums do not have polls applications which is irrelevant.The ones who you should put blame are Expansive World that they didn't implement polls application for every original author.theHunter Code of Conduct - community forums posted by Alena Rybik Community Manager currently a staff of Expansive World on January 24th, 2014, 6:55 pm.Section Only meaningful posts, please
Alena Rybik wrote:While member post count has meaning, it should not be taken too seriously. Attempts to artificially increase your post count are prohibited. This includes the mass creation of short or meaningless posts. When participating in game threads such as “Word association game” please do not post consecutive replies within a short period of time.Do not bump posts. The act of bumping one's post is considered spamming and contributes nothing constructive to the discussion. Your thread will be seen; there is no need to continually bump it to the top of the list.
Therefore there is no action will be taken care of. 'Attempts to artificially increase your post count are prohibited' we need statement facts and the way we can can get them is by statements whether is to manipulate post count or just innocent judgement and that is based on our imaginations and not facts.[/quote]
DriftPrize wrote:This post is nothing but hate and discrimination.

kring wrote:Do you care to elaborate a bit with what you mean about hate and discrimination? It feels like this might go off-topic so you're welcome to write a PM!
To make things clearer to you I am willing to explain it.From Last edited by kring on February 1st, 2014, 1:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.You stated I see this in many of the topics here and it pisses me off.To me that's a typical way of "Attempts to artificially increase your post count" (taken straight from the CoC). It doesn't add any value to the topic and posts with actual discussion or arguments gets washed away in the current.Off-topic posts are also something I can't see as meaningful. Also topics which themselves contain no discussion value at all (example: viewtopic.php?f=91&t=50704).
I think posts like this should award a warning and removal of the post itself. Re-occurring infractions leads to suspension and ultimately, a ban. I hope it's crystal clear from as i stated.(i don not need to message you privately because the rules are clear and it's is not anything personal but answering your question maturely since you asked.)


Edit:
LordBazooka wrote:Also, who cares for post counts? Seriously.

kring wrote:In an ideal world, no one gives a damn. But I've seen numerous occasion when people actually use their own post count to validate that their opinion has a higher value than others with lower post count. It's very sad.
That is based on your imagination not facts since you talk about tyrannical rules well i don't know what to say...hypoc****
User avatar
kring
Tracker
Posts: 112
Joined: October 17th, 2013, 4:59 am
Location: Limburgs, NL

Re: Harder moderation needed on the forums?

Postby kring » February 5th, 2014, 12:21 pm

DriftPrize wrote:To make things clearer to you I am willing to explain it.From Last edited by kring on February 1st, 2014, 1:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.You stated I see this in many of the topics here and it pisses me off.To me that's a typical way of "Attempts to artificially increase your post count" (taken straight from the CoC). It doesn't add any value to the topic and posts with actual discussion or arguments gets washed away in the current.Off-topic posts are also something I can't see as meaningful. Also topics which themselves contain no discussion value at all (example: viewtopic.php?f=91&t=50704).
I think posts like this should award a warning and removal of the post itself. Re-occurring infractions leads to suspension and ultimately, a ban. I hope it's crystal clear from as i stated.(i don not need to message you privately because the rules are clear and it's is not anything personal but answering your question maturely since you asked.)

I'm sorry, but I still can't see the hate and discrimination you're talking about. I'm just voicing my opinion how I think moderators should handle posts like this. To me it's only ranting to let some steam off and nothing really to discuss.

DriftPrize wrote:That is based on your imagination not facts since you talk about tyrannical rules well i don't know what to say...hypoc****

This I don't even know how to respond to.

Return to “Forums Feedback & Suggestions”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest