More "track types" for antlered animals

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BCKidd
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Re: More "track types" for antlered animals

Post by BCKidd »

gas56 wrote:
Fletchette wrote:
Sherab86 wrote:Take it easy, Gas. I know Elrique64 was maybe a little bit rude to call your knowledge and experience by the name of "garbage". But from what I know, mostly as a theorethician (but not entirely - I "hunt" sometimes with my digital camera), he was generaly right.

Personally, I do not neglect your experiences. At least, as we consider them as observations only. Problem started, when you've begin to "explain" those observations. I can certainly believe your grand-pa, uncle or whoever else, could passed on you those knowledge. And this can be quite useful when you hunt in a field, indeed. But it doesn't seems to have much in common with what is current scientiffic knowledge, simply.

For me, same goes with many hunter's revelations about "drop in tracks" shots. I can certainly believe them, when they say they did it more then several times. But I have to admitt, that when they start to speak of "knock down power", "energy transfer", etc. as a cause of their success, I'm starting to be nervous. ;)

It seems, that pure field-observations, while certainly useful for hunting purposes (I would never expect myself to approach animal with same success as you, or any other IRL hunter), dosn't necessery mean, that what is going on under the hood was realy understood as well.

But I believe you in one point for sure - I'm preety sure they can have sneeze from time to time. ;)
I assumed Gas was joking, since everything he said about IRL deer behavior was ridiculous....
What??? haven't you heard a deer sneeze.............................. :lol: :lol: :lol:

Sorry Elrique64 & Sherab86,.. yesterday I just couldn't help myself that I was just in such a joking mood.
but I figured you would know that I was joking, ridiculously joking........... :lol:
:lol: :lol: :lol: By the time I finished readin' this thread, I had tears runnin' down my cheeks, I was laughing so hard. Damn, Gas, you made my day. Now, what I like to see with all these sheds being found, are the critters with antlers, having none because they shed 'em. Or give 'em stubby antlers. Make them a "rare" animal. I always wondered why that never took place after EW introduced the sheds. If the critters are shedding them, why ain't we findin' these critters with lil' stubbies or no antlers at all? :? ;) Peace.

BCKidd.


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Keep it real!
"Careful, David, he's Canadian......They eat people you know." Fletchette.
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gas56
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Re: More "track types" for antlered animals

Post by gas56 »

Well.... I hope this little joke will make up for my ridiculous deer knowledge.......... ;)
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Last edited by gas56 on February 8th, 2018, 2:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: More "track types" for antlered animals

Post by InstinctiveArcher »

Thanks Gas, that made my day! :lol: The picture just made me laugh even harder.

Just for the record, I've seen and heard deer sneeze as well. It sounds like a dog sort of. :lol:
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Re: More "track types" for antlered animals

Post by Sherab86 »

gas56 wrote:
Fletchette wrote:
Sherab86 wrote:Take it easy, Gas. I know Elrique64 was maybe a little bit rude to call your knowledge and experience by the name of "garbage". But from what I know, mostly as a theorethician (but not entirely - I "hunt" sometimes with my digital camera), he was generaly right.

Personally, I do not neglect your experiences. At least, as we consider them as observations only. Problem started, when you've begin to "explain" those observations. I can certainly believe your grand-pa, uncle or whoever else, could passed on you those knowledge. And this can be quite useful when you hunt in a field, indeed. But it doesn't seems to have much in common with what is current scientiffic knowledge, simply.

For me, same goes with many hunter's revelations about "drop in tracks" shots. I can certainly believe them, when they say they did it more then several times. But I have to admitt, that when they start to speak of "knock down power", "energy transfer", etc. as a cause of their success, I'm starting to be nervous. ;)

It seems, that pure field-observations, while certainly useful for hunting purposes (I would never expect myself to approach animal with same success as you, or any other IRL hunter), dosn't necessery mean, that what is going on under the hood was realy understood as well.

But I believe you in one point for sure - I'm preety sure they can have sneeze from time to time. ;)
I assumed Gas was joking, since everything he said about IRL deer behavior was ridiculous....
What??? haven't you heard a deer sneeze.............................. :lol: :lol: :lol:

Sorry Elrique64 & Sherab86,.. yesterday I just couldn't help myself that I was just in such a joking mood.
but I figured you would know that I was joking, ridiculously joking........... :lol:

Ehhh... and now I feel embarased that I didn't catch the joke. :oops:
That's not fair - you know I'm not a native speaker. ;)

To be honest, after reading first post I was ready to take this as a joke. But after second one I realy tought you were a little bit angry. :P

But the picture made me laugh :D
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Re: More "track types" for antlered animals

Post by Elrique64 »

The way this thread has gone has just made me sad. Sad that a long time member of these forums can crack a joke at a serious attempt to improve the game. Sad that everyone else takes this attempt at humor and jokes it up a bit more. Sad that I spent the amount of money on this game that I have.

Well, no more of that, at least from me. My thanks Gas56, for enlightening me that the members on these forums are happy with status quo. Enjoy what you have, because without people trying to push new ideas, this is all you are going to get.

I get it. No one else thinks any real "realism" is important. This is just a game after all. A game that could be a lot better, if ideas weren't scoffed at.
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Re: More "track types" for antlered animals

Post by InstinctiveArcher »

Elrique64 wrote:The way this thread has gone has just made me sad. Sad that a long time member of these forums can crack a joke at a serious attempt to improve the game. Sad that everyone else takes this attempt at humor and jokes it up a bit more. Sad that I spent the amount of money on this game that I have.

Well, no more of that, at least from me. My thanks Gas56, for enlightening me that the members on these forums are happy with status quo. Enjoy what you have, because without people trying to push new ideas, this is all you are going to get.

I get it. No one else thinks any real "realism" is important. This is just a game after all. A game that could be a lot better, if ideas weren't scoffed at.
Hey man, lighten up a little. Nobody is making fun of your ideas, which are in fact good ones. They just wouldn't make sense so much in this game. I'm an avid deer hunter myself and although your suggestions are good, I just don't think they would work that well. For example, say you find a scrape in the game. Are you going to sit there and wait for the deer to go through whatever pattern it has programmed in until it circles back to freshen the scrape? Often times bucks will go days without visiting a scrape. In order to work in the game it would require that they come check it again in hours.
People are always calling for realism in this game which to a certain extent I get. However, of the game were totally realistic, I don't think many people would enjoy it. Sitting hours on end withou even seeing anything, much less being able to shoot 10+ deer in one hunt.
My suggestion is to just enjoy the humor in Gas's post and move on. IMO it was a very creative and well thought out post. Enjoy the game :)
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Re: More "track types" for antlered animals

Post by walt133 »

I agree with Trenton. I don't think Gas meant any disrespect. I certainly didn't mean any disrespect in my post and I am sorry if it came across that way. Take care,
Walt
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Sherab86
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Re: More "track types" for antlered animals

Post by Sherab86 »

Elrique64 wrote:The way this thread has gone has just made me sad. Sad that a long time member of these forums can crack a joke at a serious attempt to improve the game. Sad that everyone else takes this attempt at humor and jokes it up a bit more. Sad that I spent the amount of money on this game that I have.

Well, no more of that, at least from me. My thanks Gas56, for enlightening me that the members on these forums are happy with status quo. Enjoy what you have, because without people trying to push new ideas, this is all you are going to get.

I get it. No one else thinks any real "realism" is important. This is just a game after all. A game that could be a lot better, if ideas weren't scoffed at.
Oh, I realy like realism. However I have to admitt, that this goes mainly for weapons. I certainly tolerate more of "un-realism" in case of animals for gameplay purposes (how their senses are dumped and so on). I suppose there are some "old" players with indeed don't like changes. They have used to some features and so on, and they are not realy happy, when they are changed. Let's take reactions to new "heat" mechanics on PB and BRR. Some worries about EW finances probably more than EW itself. ;) But in general, I'm preety sure most of community members are open to new ideas. We don't have to be so serious about everything, I suppose. :) However, as I said, I didn't catch the joke of Gas either. :P

I guess those "ground marks", so to speak, made by bucks around a place of urinating, could be implemented in similar way, as are implemented droppings. But I would say, that tracks in general, are not very sufisticated in TH:Classic anyway. I would like to see more realistic animations and interactions between animals much more, than new kind of tracks to be honest. For example, two bucks "sparring" with each other. ;) But not with this engine, I suppose. I would be pleased also by brouder range of vocalisation types (there, where it is applicable).
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Re: More "track types" for antlered animals

Post by gas56 »

Elrique64 wrote:I get it. No one else thinks any real "realism" is important. This is just a game after all. A game that could be a lot better, if ideas weren't scoffed at.
Sorry Elrique64, but maybe I can explain a little better.
Nobody thinks that good ideas are a joke in this game, and you had laid out a lot of real good thoughts about deer...
although maybe it would have helped that you could have used the search first to see what has come up in the past years of the forum posts?
You could be surprised at just how knowledgeable theHunter forum members can be,... as a lot of real hunters and outdoors men & women frequent and use the forum just like yourself.
It is not the players that make the game,.. but the Devs that make the decisions on what works best with the best possible information they can come across.
And the game can only function with its limited older engine.
If in any way I have upset you with my joking around then I sincerely apologize to you.
Being how much you knew about the subject, I thought you would have guessed that I was just joking about it,
and get a kick out of it! I guess I was wrong....
I just hope to not discourage you about anything that is meaningful and helpful to theHunter game that you have every right to suggest any ideas in your opinions.
I hope you can have a change of mind and laugh with us and see that it is better to be happy than sad and not take it so seriously, because I believe we
all want to have the best game possible. And we surely can't have that if we don't talk about it......... :)
have a good 1.........................GAS
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Re: More "track types" for antlered animals

Post by BuckWill »

Elrique64 wrote:From Wikipedia:
Antlers are extensions of an animal's skull found in members of the deer family. They are true bone and are a single structure. They are generally found only on males, with the exception of the caribou.[1] Antlers are shed and regrown each year and function primarily as objects of sexual attraction and as weapons in fights between males for control of harems.
When antlers are regrown, they are covered in a soft velvety fur during the entire growing process. When they have reached their largest size of the year, they start to "itch" the buck, causing him to want to "scratch" at them. Deer use trees to "rub" the velvet off and prepare them for their primary purpose... Sparring with other bucks in the area to determine breeding priority with the local does. They use trees to rub this velvet off. Generally the larger the buck's antlers, the larger the tree that is used to rub off the velvet. Small bucks will usually use brush or small treelings for their rubs, while the larger ones will use trees up to 3" or 4" in diameter. Generally all bucks will use trees that are "aromatic" as they want to add that scent to their own. You can find the more dominant bucks in a given area by finding the trees he has used to rub off his velvet. All members of the deer family in NA exhibit this behavior, from Whitetail to Moose. I would guess that other deer in other areas do the same to one extent to another.

Bucks will also create scrapes. A scrape is a spot near a trail where a buck will leave a couple of different "calling cards" of his presence. One of these calling cards is the scent from his forehead glands on a broke or low hanging branch. He also clears off the ground under this branch, removing all of the dead leaves and grass. This leaves a patch of bare ground. Then the buck will "squat" over this bare ground and pee on his legs. His urine passes across the tarsal glands on his legs, combining the two scents (and pheromones) leaving it on the bare patch of ground he created. The more dominant bucks in a given area will create a larger patch of cleared ground. This appears to be mostly a Whitetail habit, although Blacktails do this to some extent as well, with modifications. Mulies have a much broader home range, and while they may make scrapes, these are much harder for a hunter to find.

Elk and Moose tend to use vocalizations to advertise their presence in an area more than their smaller cousins. Elk scrapes are extremely hard to find, but they can be found when trailing a bull. They tend to make these as they walk. They will splay out their front legs and pee on their legs, just as deer do. but they don't tear up a patch of ground to make them. I honestly don't know if moose make scrapes like their smaller cousins do. You would have to ask some of the more die-hard real life moose hunters in the community.

These are basically sign posts. They advertise the buck is in the area, and what his health condition is. This advertising marks the territory as "his" so it warns off the smaller bucks of an area. It also can tell the does in the area where they can find the bigger males when they come into cycle.

Bucks have a "home range" meaning they have an area they are generally associated to. So they will usually follow a route in their given range. They will visit the rubs several times through the rubbing season, as they still itch, and want some relief. Scrapes are something they will visit throughout the majority of the breeding season. And a dominant buck can have several of these scrapes in his home range.

I don't know if the mechanics of the game give a certain deer a "home range" or not. If it does, the idea of rubs and scrapes could be easy to incorporate, giving the hunter clues about the bucks in an area, over the clues we already get through the Hunter Mate. (Weight, trophy size, etc.) With practice, finding a rub or scrape can actually pinpoint a home range for a given deer.

Anyway, in a nutshell, these are the ideas I have for other tracks for the deer family. They could be used to help find the larger, more dominant bucks or bulls during your hunt, if they were in game.
I would love this as well, the summer maps should have deer with velvet, that would make a pretty mount. These deer signs would help a hunter pick out a perfect tree stand location,sadly each hunt is different so you can’t spend months chasing after that pick 180 typical. Trail cams would be cool as well but sadly they wouldn’t fit the game, but what they could do is make a midwestern late fall map with massive bucks with swollen necks and attitude. The racks need to grow up more than wide, where are the white tails with 13” tines?
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