Status & Game Updates 30 March 2017 - Baiting overhaul

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jualmasbr
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Re: Status & Game Updates 30 March 2017 - Baiting overhaul

Postby jualmasbr » April 4th, 2017, 1:25 pm

Unfortunately the bear barrel was the worst experience that lives in this hunt, I love to hunt bear, I did not have the barrel, I bought one in a day and he got promoted the other day, I put it in Thimbergold but he does not call a gray bear, I took the barrel to Hemendal and only disappointment. Not to mention that when you carry the barrel in the backpack you can not carry almost anything because it covers a lot of space. Disappointed, I probably do not know how to handle this equipment.
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caledonianblues
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Re: Status & Game Updates 30 March 2017 - Baiting overhaul

Postby caledonianblues » April 4th, 2017, 1:32 pm

jualmasbr wrote:Unfortunately the bear barrel was the worst experience that lives in this hunt, I love to hunt bear, I did not have the barrel, I bought one in a day and he got promoted the other day, I put it in Thimbergold but he does not call a gray bear, I took the barrel to Hemendal and only disappointment. Not to mention that when you carry the barrel in the backpack you can not carry almost anything because it covers a lot of space. Disappointed, I probably do not know how to handle this equipment.

There's no point in placing a barrel in Timbergold Trails. No animals from this reserve can be baited. Your barrel in Hemmeldal should work fine though, assuming you picked a half-decent location. It is possible to pick a location that will yield very low results, so some thought is required. It helps to place a barrel in a location where you've seen bear tracks, or where you know bears roam. I have a barrel in Hemmeldal which when I visit normally has 4 bears at it, sometimes with another couple of stragglers hanging around.

The idea of the barrel is not to carry it around. They're pretty big items, and not something a hunter would carry around in real life. They're intended to be deployed and left (or moved only when necessary). So the backpack capacity consumption is appropriate.
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Re: Status & Game Updates 30 March 2017 - Baiting overhaul

Postby L3M182 » April 4th, 2017, 1:34 pm

caledonianblues wrote:A few comments about some of the points that have been raised recently:

How the penalty is triggered
The penalty condition is triggered when a baited animal is shot. The distance of that animal from the feeder is not taken into consideration, it's literally just a check to see if the animal's state is "baited" at the time when it is shot. If true, the penalty is invoked. There is no concept of "penalty radius".

Changes to the penalty
A number of people have suggested delaying the penalty until the end of the current hunt. On the old system this is roughly how it worked, because the old system used attraction and the penalty was effectively a decrease in the attraction level (something which was taken into consideration at the start of a hunt when determining how animals were spawned, i.e. it didn't impact the current hunt). The new penalty is a complete reduction of the attraction radius rather than a reduction in attraction level (a concept which no longer exists in the revised system). When a baited animal is shot the client makes a call to the backend and the timestamp is saved. That timestamp is used to determine whether 30 minutes have passed, letting the client know whether it can reinstate the radius of the feeder. If this API call was to be delayed until the end of the hunt, there are numerous circumstances under which the API call would not be made, the most obvious being a client crash. So delaying the penalty altogether is not an option with the revised system.

What is an option, is dropping the attraction radius to zero instantly and then slowly increasing it over the next 30 minutes, back to full radius. This means the penalty is still invoked instantly but the current hunt is not a total bust since the attraction radius will immediately start to build up again over time, and by the end of the 30 minutes, it will be back at full attraction radius. This was suggested earlier in the thread by DHRifleman and seems to be the most reasonable compromise. We are going to work on implementing this but cannot give an ETA at this moment. It will require extensive testing before being patched to live.



can we take this as the official compromise to the feedback from the community or are other options still being looked at? and cheers for your work dave.
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Re: Status & Game Updates 30 March 2017 - Baiting overhaul

Postby caledonianblues » April 4th, 2017, 2:39 pm

L3M182 wrote:can we take this as the official compromise to the feedback from the community or are other options still being looked at? and cheers for your work dave.

We've gone through this thread in its entirety and read through every comment, carefully considering the options. We decided to review the implementation of a solution that we feel best represents the majority opinion, and one which we believe to be a reasonable compromise. That's not to say we're no longer going to listen to feedback. Suggestions are always welcome. However, it should be noted that the penalty will remain, in some form or other. It's not going to be removed completely as there has to be some balance in place to prevent feeders from being slaughter zones.

We're also going to increase the number of feeders per reserve from 3 to 4.
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Re: Status & Game Updates 30 March 2017 - Baiting overhaul

Postby DanthemanBoone » April 4th, 2017, 4:24 pm

@ caledonianblues

Thanks for your explanations above.
But one thing still remains unclear.
Is the attraction radius the same or greater than the penalty distance.
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Re: Status & Game Updates 30 March 2017 - Baiting overhaul

Postby Tanngnjostr » April 4th, 2017, 4:35 pm

DanthemanBoone wrote:But one thing still remains unclear.
Is the attraction radius the same or greater than the penalty distance.
Cheers.

There is no such thing as a penalty distance. Once an animal enters attraction radius (= 250m for pigs and bears, 150m for goats) and gets attracted to the bait site, it is flagged as "baited" and will stay "baited" for a while, even if it leaves attraction radius afterwards. This is to prevent an exploit: intentionally spooking an animal and driving it out of the attraction zone in order to circumvent the penalty. Only some time after leaving attraction radius the animal will lose the "baited" flag and then it can be shot without getting the penalty.
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Re: Status & Game Updates 30 March 2017 - Baiting overhaul

Postby DanthemanBoone » April 4th, 2017, 6:19 pm

Ok. so disregarding then the wrong concept of a penalty distance it would now appear from logic that with only a 150m ATTRACTION radius that the goat feeders are innefective on animals out past that distance.
Therefore sitting in a tower or any stand with a max render view and no feeder, should give the same returns as having a feeder, because no extra animals are going to come into render range. The Feeder has no effect until they are inside the 150m Attraction range.
You will be seeing the same number of animals between 150m and render, without a feeder, before they are attracted.

Maybe an increase in attraction range for goats needs to be considered in the review.
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Re: Status & Game Updates 30 March 2017 - Baiting overhaul

Postby DarkLord » April 4th, 2017, 6:40 pm

caledonianblues wrote:What is an option, is dropping the attraction radius to zero instantly and then slowly increasing it over the next 30 minutes, back to full radius. This means the penalty is still invoked instantly but the current hunt is not a total bust since the attraction radius will immediately start to build up again over time, and by the end of the 30 minutes, it will be back at full attraction radius. This was suggested earlier in the thread by DHRifleman and seems to be the most reasonable compromise. We are going to work on implementing this but cannot give an ETA at this moment. It will require extensive testing before being patched to live.

This is not a bad compromise, but I fail to see how it will fix the problem of animals coming back. Spooked animals will still run about 200m from the bait site and not be attracted to anything for about 25 mins after. They will still walk away from the bait site. If the devs insist that there must be an ingame penalty, then the only way I see to solve the problem is to lower the penalty duration to the spook duration of the baited animal, like @11mins. That would ensure their return. To make up for the change in game balance, add a second "cool down" penalty of 30mins after the session is closed.

caledonianblues wrote:We're also going to increase the number of feeders per reserve from 3 to 4.

That's an improvement, but I'd rather see 3 baits sites per map per species, so 3 hog and 3 bear on settlers, 3 hog and 3 mineral on bushrangers, ect.

DanthemanBoone wrote:Maybe an increase in attraction range for goats needs to be considered in the review.

I agree, 150m is just to small.
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Re: Status & Game Updates 30 March 2017 - Baiting overhaul

Postby DHRifleman » April 4th, 2017, 10:10 pm

DanthemanBoone wrote:Ok. so disregarding then the wrong concept of a penalty distance it would now appear from logic that with only a 150m ATTRACTION radius that the goat feeders are innefective on animals out past that distance.
Therefore sitting in a tower or any stand with a max render view and no feeder, should give the same returns as having a feeder, because no extra animals are going to come into render range. The Feeder has no effect until they are inside the 150m Attraction range.
You will be seeing the same number of animals between 150m and render, without a feeder, before they are attracted.

Maybe an increase in attraction range for goats needs to be considered in the review.

While what you say is 100% true, the feeder will allow bow hunting of them to be more productive.
I still wouldn't mind an increase in the attraction radius for them.

I am happy my suggestion was deemed as a viable compromise, but would like the minimum radius to be 10 or 15 meters instead of 0. This would allow the possibility of getting a second bear if the first was far enough away and dropped on the spot.

DarkLord wrote:This is not a bad compromise, but I fail to see how it will fix the problem of animals coming back. Spooked animals will still run about 200m from the bait site and not be attracted to anything for about 25 mins after.


Why should a spooked animal come back to the location it was spooked from?
Isn't baiting really designed for close in hunting.
The above statements are strictly my opinion, and should not be taken as fact, even if I believe them to be true.
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Re: Status & Game Updates 30 March 2017 - Baiting overhaul

Postby gas56 » April 4th, 2017, 10:11 pm

gas56 wrote:if you made the maximum attraction range to 0-1M under penalty and grew back to the maximum attraction range of 250M in set increments over the half hour.
0-1M for the first 10 minutes, 50M at 15 minutes, 100M at 20 minutes, 150M at 25 minutes, 250M at 30 minutes.
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@CB David
If you would use the numbers I suggested on the max attraction range, and the spook/fleeing distance was increased when an animal is inside a penalty range, that should take care of most of the spooked goats returning too soon and entering the attraction range again right away, but would leave all other un-spooked goats outside of the attraction range heading in that direction and roam back into the area and thus becoming attracted to the increasing max size of the attraction range while the 30 min. penalty was into effect.
Spooked Goat @ penalty range = ( Normal Flee Distance + Addition Flee Distance ) = 400 M
Last edited by gas56 on April 4th, 2017, 10:59 pm, edited 11 times in total.

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